Silence is Consent in Yugioh Just had Confirmation

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itsmetristan
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Re: Silence is Consent in Yugioh Just had Confirmation

Post #861 by itsmetristan » Thu Mar 24, 2022 7:48 pm

Sound4 wrote:
itsmetristan wrote:Madolche is far better than Unchained. The opponnent in Pen's replay wasn't even playing a good list.

Seriously? I am pretty sure I could beat a Madolche play er rather easily. How do you know that he wasn't playing a good list? I do agree with you from watching his replays in tournaments but I would like to know you reasoning. Plus here is the replay in which PENMASTER got destroyed in.
https://www.duelingbook.com/replay?id=37267411

I'll also add on to the first part here. There are a significant number of mediocre or bad Madolche players. It's interesting to see honestly. It's actually a benefit for the better players, since the worse ones make people think worse of the deck, so then the top dogs can roll in and steamroll people who underestimated the deck.

I would say the deck isn't that great rn because scythe is everywhere, but in the previous metas where tri-zoo and drytron were around, this deck was a really nice rogue pick. It obliterated Tri-zoo, and the basic T1 setups are tricky for drytron to deal with. They also have 0 ways to out a battle and monster effect immune hootcake, so followup and survival are usually guaranteed.
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Post #862 by Renji Asuka » Fri Mar 25, 2022 3:22 am

Sound4 wrote:
Renji Asuka wrote:
Christen57 wrote:
Purely on what principal?

That he needs to learn to shut the fuck up. Every time I leave this thread for any period of time, he always brings it back.

When you left the thread for a while Christen57 was the one who kept replying. I saw some flaws in what he was saying and questioning them.

No, you didn't. You just didn't accept the arguments. We already went through this.
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Post #863 by Sound4 » Fri Mar 25, 2022 7:52 pm

Renji Asuka wrote:
Sound4 wrote:
Renji Asuka wrote:That he needs to learn to shut the fuck up. Every time I leave this thread for any period of time, he always brings it back.

When you left the thread for a while Christen57 was the one who kept replying. I saw some flaws in what he was saying and questioning them.

No, you didn't. You just didn't accept the arguments. We already went through this.

I actually explained my reasoning on why I didn't agree.

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Post #864 by Sound4 » Fri Mar 25, 2022 8:04 pm

itsmetristan wrote:
Sound4 wrote:
itsmetristan wrote:Madolche is far better than Unchained. The opponnent in Pen's replay wasn't even playing a good list.

Seriously? I am pretty sure I could beat a Madolche play er rather easily. How do you know that he wasn't playing a good list? I do agree with you from watching his replays in tournaments but I would like to know you reasoning. Plus here is the replay in which PENMASTER got destroyed in.
https://www.duelingbook.com/replay?id=37267411

First of all, the build they're using isn't the most optimal build anymore. It was the best before Crossout and Small World got released. Now, the most optimal way to play the deck is with a ton of handtraps that put themselves in the GY, such as Veiler, Ash, etc. The consistency is really good because of small world, and you can use SW to bridge any excess starters into good HT's. You can also put those HT's back into your hand over and over again thanks to Chateau, meaning you can use the same Veiler twice in one turn if you add it to hand with the combination of Chateau and Teacher. This means 2 non-OPT discarding HT's effectively turn into 4 disruptions total, ON TOP OF the fact that you ALSO have promenade set, and you usually have a Hootcake that can't die by battle and is unaffected by all monster effects, keeping you alive and securing almost guaranteed followup. The HT list is so much better, but that aside, there's other problems with the current list they're using.

- Good madolche lists of this build don't run Ticket. It's too "win more" and doesn't really impact games that much. It's also annoying to draw.
- TTT is VERY bad in any Madolche list period. I could go on and on about why this is, but to boil it down, Madolche has almost 0 ways to play through a resolved handtrap. If your starter gets ash'd and you don't have crossout or CBTG, you almost always get 0 benefit from the draws. Sure you can draw into HT's but you generally don't want to put HT's in the GY until you've resolved your main combo, as having them there shuts off Peting. You get almost no benefit from the draw, the hand scope doesn't really help when they can still resolve their main combo just fine and set up a board you can't out, and the take effect doesn't matter on turn 1, and turn 2 it can ONLY bait a negate. Taking something is hardly useful enough to warrant it.
- He's running small world in a build that doesn't have enough bridges for it. From the cards we see, and the cards I assume they're running based off the build, they can't bridge stuff like Nib into a starter. Small World just isn't fantastic here as it's more strict with what you can do.

In terms of gameplay, they misplayed really badly in G2. They had game on their first turn there but went for the wrong line. They made this mistake again in game 3, but there it didn't really matter.

I wouldn't really say that replay is anything special. It's just Madolche doing Madolche things, just not nearly as optimally as it could have been. PEN definitely misplayed a couple times there, but it's excusable since Madolche isn't really a deck everyone knows the ins and outs of.

You do make a point however I think he was running TTT as he knew PENMASTER was running handraps and had a good chance of drawing them and put in TTT not to draw but to show PENMASTER'S hand to put an important card into the Deck. It gives him less to work with. I do agree ticket does not really do anything for this build and does not have much impact. Plus he does play nibiru which can help.

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Post #865 by Renji Asuka » Fri Mar 25, 2022 8:06 pm

Sound4 wrote:
Renji Asuka wrote:
Sound4 wrote:When you left the thread for a while Christen57 was the one who kept replying. I saw some flaws in what he was saying and questioning them.

No, you didn't. You just didn't accept the arguments. We already went through this.

I actually explained my reasoning on why I didn't agree.

Which amounted to you just not accepting what was being told to you.
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Post #866 by Sound4 » Fri Mar 25, 2022 8:37 pm

Renji Asuka wrote:
Sound4 wrote:
Renji Asuka wrote:No, you didn't. You just didn't accept the arguments. We already went through this.

I actually explained my reasoning on why I didn't agree.

Which amounted to you just not accepting what was being told to you.

I provided links and logs on why I didn't agree.

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Post #867 by Renji Asuka » Fri Mar 25, 2022 9:27 pm

Sound4 wrote:
Renji Asuka wrote:
Sound4 wrote:I actually explained my reasoning on why I didn't agree.

Which amounted to you just not accepting what was being told to you.

I provided links and logs on why I didn't agree.

Which were all debunked.
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Post #868 by itsmetristan » Fri Mar 25, 2022 9:31 pm

Sound4 wrote:
itsmetristan wrote:
Sound4 wrote:Seriously? I am pretty sure I could beat a Madolche play er rather easily. How do you know that he wasn't playing a good list? I do agree with you from watching his replays in tournaments but I would like to know you reasoning. Plus here is the replay in which PENMASTER got destroyed in.
https://www.duelingbook.com/replay?id=37267411

First of all, the build they're using isn't the most optimal build anymore. It was the best before Crossout and Small World got released. Now, the most optimal way to play the deck is with a ton of handtraps that put themselves in the GY, such as Veiler, Ash, etc. The consistency is really good because of small world, and you can use SW to bridge any excess starters into good HT's. You can also put those HT's back into your hand over and over again thanks to Chateau, meaning you can use the same Veiler twice in one turn if you add it to hand with the combination of Chateau and Teacher. This means 2 non-OPT discarding HT's effectively turn into 4 disruptions total, ON TOP OF the fact that you ALSO have promenade set, and you usually have a Hootcake that can't die by battle and is unaffected by all monster effects, keeping you alive and securing almost guaranteed followup. The HT list is so much better, but that aside, there's other problems with the current list they're using.

- Good madolche lists of this build don't run Ticket. It's too "win more" and doesn't really impact games that much. It's also annoying to draw.
- TTT is VERY bad in any Madolche list period. I could go on and on about why this is, but to boil it down, Madolche has almost 0 ways to play through a resolved handtrap. If your starter gets ash'd and you don't have crossout or CBTG, you almost always get 0 benefit from the draws. Sure you can draw into HT's but you generally don't want to put HT's in the GY until you've resolved your main combo, as having them there shuts off Peting. You get almost no benefit from the draw, the hand scope doesn't really help when they can still resolve their main combo just fine and set up a board you can't out, and the take effect doesn't matter on turn 1, and turn 2 it can ONLY bait a negate. Taking something is hardly useful enough to warrant it.
- He's running small world in a build that doesn't have enough bridges for it. From the cards we see, and the cards I assume they're running based off the build, they can't bridge stuff like Nib into a starter. Small World just isn't fantastic here as it's more strict with what you can do.

In terms of gameplay, they misplayed really badly in G2. They had game on their first turn there but went for the wrong line. They made this mistake again in game 3, but there it didn't really matter.

I wouldn't really say that replay is anything special. It's just Madolche doing Madolche things, just not nearly as optimally as it could have been. PEN definitely misplayed a couple times there, but it's excusable since Madolche isn't really a deck everyone knows the ins and outs of.

You do make a point however I think he was running TTT as he knew PENMASTER was running handraps and had a good chance of drawing them and put in TTT not to draw but to show PENMASTER'S hand to put an important card into the Deck. It gives him less to work with. I do agree ticket does not really do anything for this build and does not have much impact. Plus he does play nibiru which can help.

Yeah that's fine, but it's not a common scenario in which you'd want to side it in, and heaven forbid you main deck it. There's a lot of potential side cards that cover worse weaknesses and do it a whole lot better than TTT
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Post #869 by Sound4 » Sun Mar 27, 2022 5:45 pm

itsmetristan wrote:
Sound4 wrote:
itsmetristan wrote:First of all, the build they're using isn't the most optimal build anymore. It was the best before Crossout and Small World got released. Now, the most optimal way to play the deck is with a ton of handtraps that put themselves in the GY, such as Veiler, Ash, etc. The consistency is really good because of small world, and you can use SW to bridge any excess starters into good HT's. You can also put those HT's back into your hand over and over again thanks to Chateau, meaning you can use the same Veiler twice in one turn if you add it to hand with the combination of Chateau and Teacher. This means 2 non-OPT discarding HT's effectively turn into 4 disruptions total, ON TOP OF the fact that you ALSO have promenade set, and you usually have a Hootcake that can't die by battle and is unaffected by all monster effects, keeping you alive and securing almost guaranteed followup. The HT list is so much better, but that aside, there's other problems with the current list they're using.

- Good madolche lists of this build don't run Ticket. It's too "win more" and doesn't really impact games that much. It's also annoying to draw.
- TTT is VERY bad in any Madolche list period. I could go on and on about why this is, but to boil it down, Madolche has almost 0 ways to play through a resolved handtrap. If your starter gets ash'd and you don't have crossout or CBTG, you almost always get 0 benefit from the draws. Sure you can draw into HT's but you generally don't want to put HT's in the GY until you've resolved your main combo, as having them there shuts off Peting. You get almost no benefit from the draw, the hand scope doesn't really help when they can still resolve their main combo just fine and set up a board you can't out, and the take effect doesn't matter on turn 1, and turn 2 it can ONLY bait a negate. Taking something is hardly useful enough to warrant it.
- He's running small world in a build that doesn't have enough bridges for it. From the cards we see, and the cards I assume they're running based off the build, they can't bridge stuff like Nib into a starter. Small World just isn't fantastic here as it's more strict with what you can do.

In terms of gameplay, they misplayed really badly in G2. They had game on their first turn there but went for the wrong line. They made this mistake again in game 3, but there it didn't really matter.

I wouldn't really say that replay is anything special. It's just Madolche doing Madolche things, just not nearly as optimally as it could have been. PEN definitely misplayed a couple times there, but it's excusable since Madolche isn't really a deck everyone knows the ins and outs of.

You do make a point however I think he was running TTT as he knew PENMASTER was running handraps and had a good chance of drawing them and put in TTT not to draw but to show PENMASTER'S hand to put an important card into the Deck. It gives him less to work with. I do agree ticket does not really do anything for this build and does not have much impact. Plus he does play nibiru which can help.

Yeah that's fine, but it's not a common scenario in which you'd want to side it in, and heaven forbid you main deck it. There's a lot of potential side cards that cover worse weaknesses and do it a whole lot better than TTT

I see no reason to main deck it. TTT is not that good for Madolche.

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Post #870 by Sound4 » Sun Mar 27, 2022 5:46 pm

Renji Asuka wrote:
Sound4 wrote:
Renji Asuka wrote:Which amounted to you just not accepting what was being told to you.

I provided links and logs on why I didn't agree.

Which were all debunked.

I am not so sure about that.

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Post #871 by Renji Asuka » Sun Mar 27, 2022 8:33 pm

Sound4 wrote:
Renji Asuka wrote:
Sound4 wrote:I provided links and logs on why I didn't agree.

Which were all debunked.

I am not so sure about that.

You were not so sure about us telling you how you're wrong and you still kept going for 40+ pages.
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Post #872 by Sound4 » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:13 pm

Renji Asuka wrote:
Sound4 wrote:
Renji Asuka wrote:Which were all debunked.

I am not so sure about that.

You were not so sure about us telling you how you're wrong and you still kept going for 40+ pages.

The logs and links I provided were all factual and from official sources.

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Post #873 by greg503 » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:42 pm

Sound4 wrote:
Renji Asuka wrote:
Sound4 wrote:I am not so sure about that.

You were not so sure about us telling you how you're wrong and you still kept going for 40+ pages.

The logs and links I provided were all factual and from official sources.

Wikia: "official source", you heard it here first folks
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Post #874 by DarwisBellium92 » Mon Mar 28, 2022 2:50 pm

Sound4 wrote:
Renji Asuka wrote:
Sound4 wrote:I am not so sure about that.

You were not so sure about us telling you how you're wrong and you still kept going for 40+ pages.

The logs and links I provided were all factual and from official sources.

Sound4, you were wrong but enough of this complaint!
To be wrong is human but I think you don't understand Renji's words.
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Post #875 by Renji Asuka » Mon Mar 28, 2022 6:36 pm

Sound4 wrote:
Renji Asuka wrote:
Sound4 wrote:I am not so sure about that.

You were not so sure about us telling you how you're wrong and you still kept going for 40+ pages.

The logs and links I provided were all factual and from official sources.

Which again, you were still wrong lmao
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Post #876 by Sound4 » Tue Mar 29, 2022 2:23 pm

greg503 wrote:
Sound4 wrote:
Renji Asuka wrote:You were not so sure about us telling you how you're wrong and you still kept going for 40+ pages.

The logs and links I provided were all factual and from official sources.

Wikia: "official source", you heard it here first folks

It is some what reliable since it is used for rulings and a few other things.

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Post #877 by Sound4 » Tue Mar 29, 2022 2:24 pm

Renji Asuka wrote:
Sound4 wrote:
Renji Asuka wrote:You were not so sure about us telling you how you're wrong and you still kept going for 40+ pages.

The logs and links I provided were all factual and from official sources.

Which again, you were still wrong lmao

Explain you have yet to still debunk any of my links.

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Post #878 by Sound4 » Tue Mar 29, 2022 2:25 pm

DarwisBellium92 wrote:
Sound4 wrote:
Renji Asuka wrote:You were not so sure about us telling you how you're wrong and you still kept going for 40+ pages.

The logs and links I provided were all factual and from official sources.

Sound4, you were wrong but enough of this complaint!
To be wrong is human but I think you don't understand Renji's words.

I think you should read my previous posts lok at page 1 it will help.

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Post #879 by DarwisBellium92 » Tue Mar 29, 2022 2:31 pm

Sound4 wrote:
DarwisBellium92 wrote:
Sound4 wrote:The logs and links I provided were all factual and from official sources.

Sound4, you were wrong but enough of this complaint!
To be wrong is human but I think you don't understand Renji's words.

I think you should read my previous posts lok at page 1 it will help.

I'm not stupid, I've read all your stupid and useless pages! Are you wrong? Well, don't complain and make this useless drama, just accept your mistakes!
Im cardmaker pioneer with 15 years experience, KONAMI member illustrator and 360 degrees artist
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Post #880 by Renji Asuka » Tue Mar 29, 2022 2:37 pm

Sound4 wrote:
Renji Asuka wrote:
Sound4 wrote:The logs and links I provided were all factual and from official sources.

Which again, you were still wrong lmao

Explain you have yet to still debunk any of my links.

Everything was debunked by page 1. Lmao
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