Duelingbook Forum

what do you think of the new bear card I like them its refreshing take in Syncro and they seem really fair and its cool that they have a self limiter cause they ss themselves from deck and arent properly summoned making them impossible to summon from gy normally so seems really good to me I wonder what they will miss it with for it to become broken and unfair cause pure decks would be fun to play and against

Pretty sure summoning them with their condition counts as properly summoning them

it doesent it has to be syncoed to be properly summoned that only applies to main deck ones

I thought they said "Must FIRST be Special Summoned from the Extra Deck by ..."
nvm deck is garbage lol

greg503 wrote:Pretty sure summoning them with their condition counts as properly summoning them

it does, the thing is, how many cards do you know of can special summon monsters from the graveyard ignoring their summoning conditions

Neo_Fire_Sonic wrote:

greg503 wrote:Pretty sure summoning them with their condition counts as properly summoning them

it does, the thing is, how many cards do you know of can special summon monsters from the graveyard ignoring their summoning conditions

Level Modulation is the only one that comes to mind off the top of my head.

properly summing for ed monsters only counts as how you would normally summon them unless it says counts as a Syncro summon you cant plus one of the bear cards states summon from ed ignoring summoning conditions it would say that if it counted as properly summing

PENMASTER wrote:properly summing for ed monsters only counts as how you would normally summon them unless it says counts as a Syncro summon you cant plus one of the bear cards states summon from ed ignoring summoning conditions it would say that if it counted as properly summing

I'm pretty sure Monster Reborn can bring back ABC Dragon Buster, despite it not being Fusion Summoned. "Proper summons" are the mechanic, or listed on the card itself. (If you just said this than I'm sorry but you worded it confusingly)

nope still wrong
the only proper summon is the base summon for each card type aka fusion syncro xyz link summon
like I've been saying main deck and ed proper summons are different
btw have you ever wondered why ding says its summon counts as an xyz summon so it can be brought back

If only Konami judges would allow this shit as inherent, defined terms... like "fizzle"

PENMASTER wrote:nope still wrong
the only proper summon is the base summon for each card type aka fusion syncro xyz link summon
like I've been saying main deck and ed proper summons are different
btw have you ever wondered why ding says its summon counts as an xyz summon so it can be brought back

I'm not sure if I got it right. Should I take it that you mean that a monster like Gladiator Beast Gyzarus properly summoned by its own effect can't be brought back by Monster Reborn because it wasn't summoned by a Fusion Summon? Because, if so, that really goes against every duel with GBs I've had, including in video games. The same goes for Chimeratech Fortress Dragon, which cannot be fusion summoned as well.

Back to the main subject, though, those bears are the first kind of semi-nomi, non-fusion Extra Deck monsters that has a distinct way to properly summon them from there, so we should expect the same rulings that most Contact Fusion monsters have for that regard.

If in doubt, the rulebook basically got us covered, on page 25 (https://www.yugioh-card.com/en/rulebook/):

Monsters can also be Special Summoned onto the field through the effect of another card. This is different from “Special Summon Monsters. You cannot use a card effect to Special Summon those monsters from your hand, Deck, or the Graveyard unless it was properly Special Summoned first. For example, if a Synchro Monster is sent from your Extra Deck to the Graveyard without being Synchro Summoned, you cannot use a Spell Card to Special Summon it from the Graveyard, because Synchro Monsters have to be properly Special Summoned first, before they can be Special Summoned by another card’s effect.

Bearcti synchro monsters do mention that they cannot be Synchro Summoned, but they also state the proper way to summon them. Since the rulebook doesn't focus on the "base summon" but rather on the monster being "properly Special Summoned", they should be revived if summoned as described in their effects.

That's how I see we should be playing them. Although, practically, we should just wait for their rulings, whenever they get released.

i mean what really confirmed my point was the house of champs guy saying you can't but I already thought it before its like ph he agrees kinda thing and literally everything I've heard about properly summing agrees with me
and the rule book thing I don't see how that helps anyone it really just confirms my thing

DuskWill wrote:Bearcti synchro monsters do mention that they cannot be Synchro Summoned, but they also state the proper way to summon them. Since the rulebook doesn't focus on the "base summon" but rather on the monster being "properly Special Summoned", they should be revived if summoned as described in their effects.

That's how I see we should be playing them. Although, practically, we should just wait for their rulings, whenever they get released.

You got it right DuskWill. I'm no judge but it doesn't said "cannot be Special Summoned by other way". So after the 1st proper new summon mechanic, I'm sure you can revive it if in the GY or banished the normal ways.

PENMASTER wrote:i mean what really confirmed my point was the house of champs guy saying you can't but I already thought it before its like ph he agrees kinda thing and literally everything I've heard about properly summing agrees with me
and the rule book thing I don't see how that helps anyone it really just confirms my thing

Well, I quoted the rulebook to show how the rule not being that specific towards the usual method for each Extra Deck card type (like you seemed to imply) did make it possible for fusion monsters cannot be Fusion Summoned (relying on Contact Fusion instead) to be brought back from the grave or after getting banished. By analogy, those Bearcti would have the same grave/banished feature.

Still, this shouldn't be an issue until their rulings get released. At this point, we have as much insight as if we never got their effects in the first place.

Rocket2 wrote:

DuskWill wrote:Bearcti synchro monsters do mention that they cannot be Synchro Summoned, but they also state the proper way to summon them. Since the rulebook doesn't focus on the "base summon" but rather on the monster being "properly Special Summoned", they should be revived if summoned as described in their effects.

That's how I see we should be playing them. Although, practically, we should just wait for their rulings, whenever they get released.

You got it right DuskWill. I'm no judge but it doesn't said "cannot be Special Summoned by other way". So after the 1st proper new summon mechanic, I'm sure you can revive it if in the GY or banished the normal ways.

Proper way or not, the monsters say "must be..." instead of "must first be..." so Reborn effects don't work on them anyways

greg503 wrote:

Rocket2 wrote:Proper way or not, the monsters say "must be..." instead of "must first be..." so Reborn effects don't work on them anyways

Ah! U r right. Somehow it spilled my mind.

greg503 wrote:Proper way or not, the monsters say "must be..." instead of "must first be..." so Reborn effects don't work on them anyways

Well, when you put it that way... Yeah, it makes sense.

I was mostly skeptical about those cards not having this issue, since the translation wasn't official and no rulings have been released yet, but we do have already nomi monsters that lacks the "first" from their only summoning method while lacking as well the "... and cannot be Special Summoned by other ways.". Like with Desert Twister, Elder Entity N'tss and Timaeus the Knight of Destiny. At least with the latter two, the OCG rulings points out that you cannot use Monster Reborn on them, regardless if they were properly summoned.

So... yes, now I think that's how we should be playing them until some rulings stating otherwise get released.

right but maybe not in the way I thought