dice roll to dicide who go first

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yasser123
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dice roll to dicide who go first

Post #1 by yasser123 » Mon Aug 19, 2019 12:05 pm

is there any way to change DB to dice roll to decide who first
i think rock paper sciscor is realy stupid
cuz iam one of the players that i expect what other player is going to do
and win almost all of them
so plz change it

Player1
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Post #2 by Player1 » Mon Aug 19, 2019 1:32 pm

Could be cool, but also pointless. Picking for rps helps to confirm that both players are there and ready to duel. Just roll a dice yourself then pick rock/paper/scissors based on your own roll, if you want your picks to be completely luck based.

xDEADCENTREx
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Post #3 by xDEADCENTREx » Mon Aug 19, 2019 2:22 pm

Player1 wrote:Could be cool, but also pointless. Picking for rps helps to confirm that both players are there and ready to duel. Just roll a dice yourself then pick rock/paper/scissors based on your own roll, if you want your picks to be completely luck based.


You forgot to add that a Dice Animation would cause more data packets to be required to load it, causing the delay for commands to be increased, especially during potential "peek times" and cause lag issues, which would be a bigger inconvenience to any users already suffering lag issues outsite of the network.

I also find that RPS allows a component of "skill", for instance, if you already know your opponent's habits, which offsite bases have been used to determine the following:

What a DB User will use when picking first at the RPS Menu

What a DB User usually uses at the RPS Menu and how they pick their next selection

What a DB user usually uses as their Dueling Deck

This has been known to both on site users, tournament entrants of olde, and some regulars in the DB Discord Channel. If anything for "this" reason, I would advocate the Dice Method, however I feel the trade-off for the lag is not worth the hassle, especially since after reading this, users are informed and will use that same strategy to counter someone trying to counter their RPS choice, much like Tournaments and Replays tend to leave an image to a users deck of choice, and countering abilities.

As the system for this is, I would prefer RPS for the above listed reasons.

However I will also argue that RPS is NOT random by any means to the mindful user, whereas a Dice Roll would always be randomly generated.

THAT SAID, when Dueling Network existed, people had issues with people accusing the Programming to be biased against Exodia the Forbidden One decks in rated, leaving the last piece to be in the last tens cards.

I conclude that you literally cannot please everyone, and people will always have suggestions. That said I highly request you keep Rock Paper Scissors, instead of this Suggestion to switch it to Dice Roll.

PS: Adding Dice Roll as a 2nd option, would cause further lag issues, so I advocate against that option also if it comes up.

-Nick

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Post #4 by Christen57 » Sun May 03, 2020 8:20 pm

Player1 wrote:Could be cool, but also pointless. Picking for rps helps to confirm that both players are there and ready to duel.

We already have the system where you go into the Duel Room and choose to duel in rated, then when the site pairs you up with another player it starts counting down from 10 and then you have to click the button to indicate that you are ready to duel, and so does the other player. So this argument that having this extra unnecessary thing "helps to confirm that both players are there" doesn't work.

xDEADCENTREx wrote:
Player1 wrote:Could be cool, but also pointless. Picking for rps helps to confirm that both players are there and ready to duel. Just roll a dice yourself then pick rock/paper/scissors based on your own roll, if you want your picks to be completely luck based.


You forgot to add that a Dice Animation would cause more data packets to be required to load it, causing the delay for commands to be increased, especially during potential "peek times" and cause lag issues, which would be a bigger inconvenience to any users already suffering lag issues outsite of the network.

I also find that RPS allows a component of "skill", for instance, if you already know your opponent's habits, which offsite bases have been used to determine the following:

What a DB User will use when picking first at the RPS Menu

What a DB User usually uses at the RPS Menu and how they pick their next selection

What a DB user usually uses as their Dueling Deck

RPS does not allow "a component of skill". You are just picking rock paper or scissor. If you want to have a "component of skill" to rock paper scissors, then make it so that rock paper scissors has more depth to it or something. For example, you could introduce some kind of point system where, instead of winning 1 game of rock paper scissor to decide who goes first, players have to acquire a certain amount of points by winning games of rock paper scissors with certain options. For example, you could make it so that the first player to acquire 4 points will get to decide who goes first, and winning with scissor earns you 3 points, winning with paper earns you 2 points, and that winning with rock earns you 1 point. That way, there is an element of risk and reward to it, which adds more depth to rock paper scissors. Now, a player might want to go for scissor, since it would earn them the most points if they won with it, but the opponent may predict that the player would go for that high reward option, so that opponent would go for rock, but would only earn then 1 point, and so on.

xDEADCENTREx wrote:THAT SAID, when Dueling Network existed, people had issues with people accusing the Programming to be biased against Exodia the Forbidden One decks in rated, leaving the last piece to be in the last tens cards.

Mathematically speaking, the chance of any 1-of being in the last ten cards in a 40-card deck when that deck is shuffled is 25%, and 25% is a pretty decent chance. That chance of that 1-of being in the last ten cards again, in that 40-card deck, when you shuffle it again, is going to be 12.5%. The chance of that happening for the third time in a row is 6.25%. The chance of it happening for the fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh, eighth, and ninth time, in a row, is 3.125%, 1.5625%, 0.78125%, 0.390625%, 0.1953125%, and 0.09765625%, respectively.

Regardless, the programming is still capable of being biased regardless if you have rock paper scissors, or if you have dice rolling. In rock paper scissors, the code could easily be written where you have a chance of being secretly told what your opponent picked. I'm not saying that this is currently the case, but something like that could be possible.

On top of that, having rock paper scissors won't stop people from accusing the system or the other player of having an unfair advantage or bias. You can still have ignorant people accusing the winner of rock paper scissors of magically reading their minds or something to know what they would pick.

I think it's faster to simply have duelingbook randomly pick the player who will decide who gets to go first.


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